Blue Tongue

[jazzactivist]

Hi! all, this is another blow for the farming community. It seems that no matter how hard we try to shift people away from shopping with multinationals to suport local farmers, something else comes along that limits access to farm shops / Famers Markets. We are being told that this disease will not affect milk or meat, but I wonder if there will be a need to state on packaging if the product is from a Blue Tongue infected area. I am a bit concerned that, even though humans can't be affected, by eating these products there may be a chance that humans build up the toxins in our bodies and then if a midge bites us the disease could be carried on to other stock. Is it time to all become vegans, with meat as a special luxury? We could certainly grow more food that way. What do you think?

[Oola]

I think it's time people didn't expect to eat meat every day. I'm not saying this because I'm a vegetarian, I'm saying this because it's clear that the strain being placed on the intense 'manufacturing' of animals is just causing a glut of problems that won't, quite frankly, go away. Rich, my other half, eats meat but in the last two years the amount of meat he's eaten has reduced dramatically (I think in part since we've had our hens too!), but when he eats it, and buys a really good quality piece of meat, he does enjoy it. He sees it as a treat, but it's just sad that these days it's seen as normal to have it every single day, sometimes twice a day. We certainly weren't built to eat it that much, and it's plain to see that farming animals in such intense numbers, proximity and conditions is really hard to control. Someone always suffers, more often than not it's the animals, but further along down the line humans begin to feel the effects too. It seems that at this late stage is only when the authorities step in.

The only way to stop people consuming so much is to place an old-fashioned Meat Ration, but there would be outcry and mumblings of 'Nannie State' and other buzz words.

I also worry about what I'm feeding my cats, how many hormones and things they're ingesting each time they eat the food I put down for them. Organic cat food is so incredibly expensive, but I don't really have another option. Sometimes I think these companies take the p*ss, with 'speciality' organic cat food being priced way above anything else...I think they add on a premium when using the words 'organic', which will drive most people away.

[jazzactivist]

Hi Oola, I agree with you. Although Andy, my partner, and I eat meat we don't eat it every day, and I prefer vegetarian food anyway as there are so many different ways to cook vegetables and accompaniments that you never get bored. We buy organic meat from a farm shop and only buy what we predict we will need. The problem in the UK is that meat is traditionally the main part of all meals, look at the trad. roast dinner, so maybe it's time to change our eating habits to match those in some Mediterranean countries and have meat as almost a garnish. If meat rationing helps, so be it!

My poor old dog finds it hard to digest cooked meat now, so I am a bit limited to only complete foods. I worry about what I feed him too, but have found that James Wellbeloved seems to be the best with some of the most ethical credentials. I don't know if they do cat food, though.

[Redstart]

I agree too and prefer to eat less but fairly farmed organic meat. The main problem is that meat tends to push vegetables out and so many people just don't eat enough vegetables. They could eat meat every day if they insisted, as long as they ate a small amount of meat together with lots of vegetables - I made a curry today that was mostly vegetables (onion, carrot, cauliflower, green beans) with a bit of chicken. Had I made a chicken curry I would have needed two to three times as much meat. It's all a matter of what is most important in a meal - and I agree, a lot of vegetarian meals are extremely tasty and satisfying.

I used to be vegetarian but it was discovered, during my third pregnancy, that I don't absorb non-haem iron (I lack the chemical required to do this); so I need to eat meat - but experimentation has shown me that I do not need to eat massive amounts of it and I don't like meals that are predominently meat. I need my vegetables!

[Oola]

Does anyone know exactly what the symptoms of Blue Tongue are and how they tend to come about? I'm guessing the spread of the disease is down to intense farming, but I don't really know an awful lot about the background of it.

[Redstart]

According to various sites I've looked at it is caused by a certain midge (Culicoides) and can only be transmitted by the midge. It replicates within the midge and it only affects ruminants, which is why they say that there is no record of transmission to humans. The Defra site warns that it can also be transmitted by unhygienic practices, such as dirty syringes and contaminated surgical equipment. Peak occurence occurs in late summer and autumn, when that particular midge also has peak populations. Apparently it mainly occurs in sheep but can also appear in cattle, though less often.

Does that help?

[Oola]

Yes thanks...seems that due to climate change the midges are coming further north?

So aside from the obvious (Blue Tongue), what else does it do to the animal?

[jazzactivist]

It seems to kill quite large quantities of the infected animals. On a news report yesterday evening it said that in some countries farmers lose a third of their stock to Blue Tongue. Animals can be sent to the abattoir and turned into meat for consumption even if they are infected.

[sunflower]

I think we should return to the old fashioned way of meat eating. Families used to buy a large enough piece of meat that would last all week. I'm sure that this meant that each portion of meat was probably smaller than what people expect today.

[CountryLady]

Just going back to the petfood issue, James Wellbeloved do make catfood, it's what my bunch eat and I have found it to be the best.

[SheepyJames]

I worry that Blue Tongue is more of a threat than Foot and Mouth because it is almost impossible to control. The warm, damp winter we are forecast won't help, and now that the disease is established in UK we are probably going to be stuck with it unless they can come up with a vaccine. Sheep are the least intensively farmed animal, but that won't help with this disease.

[SummerSkye]

We used to be big meat eaters as most of our generation are or were; nowadays we eat lots more vegetables (home grown) rice&pasta instead of potatoes and more fish. Two or three days per week are meat free by choice. In my mother's day meat was needed to balance the meal whereas now we cook differently with inspiration from many different countries where none or very little meat is used.
I must admit that any talk of disease in an animal is enough to turn me away from eating it. My little dog prefers fish to meat and will quite happily have tinned kippers or tuna;as he only eats a small amount this is not as extravagant as it sounds.

[SheepyJames]

SummerSkye, my little dog knows what's good for her - she has refused from a very small puppy to eat anything other than what we eat ourselves!

[Oola]

SheepyJames whereabouts did you find out about the forecast for this winter? It seems in the past few years we've been having to brace ourselves for a 'deep freeze'....that never arrived!

[SheepyJames]

Oh, I wouldn't get too excited Oola! It was our local guy and he hasn't got a great track record! Under the circumstances I'm hoping he's got it wrong again and we're in for cold frosty bug-killing season.

I watched Countryfile today and it was hinted that a Bluetongue vaccine might become available sometime next year. Good news for farmers, but yet another nasty in the meat?

[Oola]

Will the vaccine be compulsory?

[jazzactivist]

I hope that we will have a cold, frosty winter to get rid of a lot of the insects and diseases too. Looking back over past gardening journals it seems that every 4 years we seem to have a mild wet winter followed by a miserable wet summer, and that a good long cold snap is followed by a dry hot summer. Maybe global warming does have a lot to do with it, but I was surprised to read back about the weather conditions over the past 15 years.

Where I live we usually have a day's snowfall in October every year and looking out of the window today the sky is full of it and I can feel the temperature dropping. At least it will be a change from warm and wet, and I have spotted lots of plump sloes down the pass, so a frosty night will soon make them ready to pick.

[Oola]

I'm waiting for the first frosts so I can pull up some of my parsnips! I don't recall when the frosts started last year? In fact I don't recall much at all from last year, come to think of it....

[susiedart]

Blue tongue is caused by this unusually mild autumn bringing so many midges and if bitten the animal can die or could survive, the effects are rather like tonsilitis in humans. It is not to do with intensive farming, just too many midges not being killed off by frost, like the ticks, which are numerous.

[SheepyJames]

I don't know if the vaccine would be compulsory, Oola. There aren't any that are at the moment - not for sheep, anyway. I got a bit of a scare today when I found one of my lambs hiding in a corner with saliva pouring from her mouth. In the end I decided she must have eaten something which had got stuck or scratched her throat. I gave her a hefty dose of cod liver oil and she seems absolutely fine now. Phew!!!

[SheepyJames]

Welcome Susiedart, by the way! Sheepy.

[SheepyJames]

Last posting on this thread was October last year and - guess what? - I eventually vaccinated my sheep against Blue Tongue 10 days ago which means that from today they should be protected! My goodness DEFRA works in a mysterious and exceptionally slow way their wonders to perform!!!